12.18.2006

the goat speaks out...

got a couple of questions the last few weeks, thought i'd do a post on them:

Hey Goat, I see you race a Moots. Those are out of my budget. Any thoughts on cross bikes in the $1500 price range? I'm really looking hard at that cross bike from Felt. Spec'd real nice with Ultegra and 105 parts, plus it is that sweet flat black color scheme.

Checked out the Felt website, looks like a pretty decent bike - very similar to the RedLine Conquest Pro in color, groupo, etc.

Few things that I look at in a cross bike:
1. Rear spacing - make sure it comes with 130mm spacing. I run 135 spacing so I can run my 29er wheels for backups, and the trend was years ago to run 135 to space out the rear triangle so you can run bigger tires. But - you must consider that your backup wheels will probably come off your road bike that runs 130 spacing.

2. Rear triangle width - see what the biggest tire you can run on the frame. I run 32's, but some guys like to run 34's. So what? Try racing on a muddy course and watch the mud build up and slowly make pedaling your bike a hell of a lot harder.

3. Cranks - if it runs a double crank, check the ring options/sizes it comes with and also if it is running standard or compact rings. And check the prices it is to replace them. I run a standard 42 ring with third eye catch and a chain gaurd - I found that I really never used my other ring, and this setup is lot cheaper to run all around.

4. Cable routing - when I see a cross bike with down tube cable routing, it drives me nuts. I would stay a mile away from any frame that ran it as you are going to have a 150% certainty to have an issue with grabing the down tube for dismounts or if you race in muddy/ice conditions, your cables with gunk up and screw up your shifting for certain.

5. Compact vs. Standard Frames - I have had both and would recomend running a standard frame or a compact frame with VERY LITTLE sloping top tube. You need to have space to lug that bike onto your back for dismounts/runs and compact frames just make it a lot more uncomfortable.



Hey Goat, just curious, in the winter where do you ride in Ohio? On the roads? Or on the trails? I know most of the bike paths seem to remain covered and are used by cc skiers. So, do you do mostly road work? I remember last winter you were working a lot down in Cincy so you were able to ride the snow-free bike paths down there, but I know up here in northern Ohio we don't have a lot of snow-free bike paths.

I ride mostly on the metropark trails - some of the trials run through Kent and Stow, so I hook up on them there and take them all over the place. Do it mostly to stay out of traffic/wind and ride them year round, ice covered or not. I don't have a standard bike I ride, but to be honest, I can say that I really don't ride the mountain bikes too much. I've trained probably the most this year on my road bike, but since September, I've been mostly riding my cross bikes. With cross over and bad weather in, I'll be riding my new winter bike, a Soma 29er that I picked up to replace my Karate Monkey. It runs around 400 bucks for the frame, but it is soooo much lighter then the surly. Watch for a review of the Soma in the next few weeks.


Congrats at the Worlds this year! Your a hell of an athlete and it's cool Ohio has someone like you to represent. I have a Fisher Xcaliber 29er that is going to be my race bike this coming season for the OMBC series. The stock wheelset is a bit heavy, and I was looking into the prospect of lightening it up with something else. From your past blogs from last winter, it looks like you are using King hubs, Schwalbe Little Alberts, and some kind of Bontrager rim (Curious as to what rime that is). I think I remember you stating that you are also using tubes. Is what you are using fairly lightweight and are you happy with it and would you change anything about your wheelset setup if your were doing the 2-3 hour OMBC rcaes? Your input is appreciated.

I have been running nothing but Kings for the last few years (did a stint with last years xtr, but didn't like the slow cassette engagement) and ran either the Salsa Delgado rim (500 grams/rim) or the Bontrager Mustang 29er rim (480 grams/rim) with double butted spokes, alloy nips, salsa tubes and Schwalbe tires. Ran the Delgados because at the time, they were one of the lightest out there, and then had a chance to run the Bontragers and decided to give them a try to, but supplies were limited at the time, so Dan the man could only grab one set at the time.

I've been really happy with both the rims/wheels. For a standard no-frills semi-lightweight rim, Salsa has a nice product and you can't beat the price. Bottom line, they make nice stuff. Genuine George built up all my wheels, and my one set of race wheels I've used for two years - I think Dan touched them up maybe twice and I've had a ton of miles on them.

Though they are light, next year, we are gong to more then likely run a lighter setup based off of the guy's at speedgoat (dan the man and chris's) recomendations. We'll probably end up running the DT Swiss 240 hubs (268 grams/rear, 160 grams front) with the Stan ZTR (415 grams/rim), alloy nips and salsa tubes.

The hubs will save about roughly 50 grams of rotational weight, the rims about 80 grams per wheel. Durability? Not a problem - speedgoat has tested this stuff, and it's holding up.

As far as tires go, the lighter the better, but don't sacrifice weight for performance - think rotational weight. Check out the Scwhalble's or some of the new Bontragers.

And, as far as Stan's setup goes for going tubeless, I have stayed far away, but others love the light setup. I personally don't use them as my hands take a beating during my enduro events and I have a hard enough time holding onto the bars, let alone trying to tear off a tire with a super tight bead and then having to deal with all the latex sealant... yuck.


that's it for tonight - sologoat out.

7 comments:

Anonymous said...

You are misinformed about the NoTubes system. The beauty of NoTubes is that you do not have to use a 'super tight bead' tire. You can use your standard, loose bead, lightweight conventional tire. You can then fill it with latex, and lose about half the weight of a tube. Once sealed up, the chances of having to tear the tire off are much smaller. If you do have to tear it off, it is no more difficult than your tubed tire to remove. Yes, you may have to get some latex on your hands, but think of this -- I raced the entire 2006 season - over 35 race days on my mountain bike -- and did not have to remove a tire once. I burped air at Deer Valley, but the sealant sealed the tire and a quick shot of BigAir had me rolling in under 30 seconds. Using tubes in the ZTR rims would be quite moronic as they are impeccable when paired with conventional tires and sealant. Try it out, you will be faster. I look forward to your review!

-EH

Solo Goat said...

noted - a lot of my info came from what i have heard others tell me, so i am speaking on the advice from others. did not mean to mislead anybody.

the other aspect/reason i didn't use the setup was because of travel issues as i didn't want to hassle with the latex as my wheel/bike boxes don't like wheels that have air in the tires.

think i'll give the system a shot in training next year and if it works OK, then i'll switch over.

thanks for the info!

any others out there with good/bad notubes recomendations?

Anonymous said...

Great info 'goat, thanks!!

Anonymous said...

Yo sologoat, what do you think of this Jamis Supernova cyclocross bike. For about $1800, I'm not sure it can be beat... http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/bikes/07_bikes/supernova.html

Solo Goat said...

just checked out the supernova.

nice groupo package and the weight seems pretty decent - liked the ultegra all around on the major drive parts, and that easton carbon fork is hella light. picked one up at the shop last time i was there - very light and stiff.

and the frame - pretty impressive. really liked the formed top tube for shoulder mounts - nice touch, along with the top tube routed cables.

great choice, nice price.

Anonymous said...

G'day man, yeah been running almost the identical wheelset that you want to build up for about 2 years now. DT Swiss 240 centrelock hubs, Stan's ZTR rims and Sapim CX-Ray spokes with allow nipples. The CX-Ray spokes really help to stiffen up the 29'er wheel, the complete wheelset comes in at 1555gr without skewers. Am running the Bontrager Jones XR tyres with the NoTubes conversion. Awesome! Rode WSC like this, no problems other than me getting tired and parking myself up against a tree.

Anonymous said...

Using ZTR rims without the tubeless system is not moronic. It is a good, light, strong rim on its own merits.

If you occasionally break spokes, the yellow tape tubeless system is not the way to go. You'll be kicking yourself each time you need to swap a spoke, as it takes a good hour or two to get a Stan's system properly installed.

Personally, I prefer the ZTR's with standard tires and tubes on my 29er. Having had more than a few riding buds "burp" or otherwise de-bead their tires, I chose reliability over a few grams (which I offset with a killer wheel build).

For the record, I run Mavic tubeless (Crossmax) on my 26er, with Stan's sealant.